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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 20, 2012 13:38:56 GMT -5
I fixed the last post with an edit. I had it backwards the first time. 74% voted no.
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 20, 2012 23:30:07 GMT -5
According to a source of someone on the ZoneNordiques board (tomy300), Pelladeau was asked by Bettman if the new Quebec team could be ready on short notice, if need be. The answer "yes" was given to Bettman.
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 21, 2012 12:04:49 GMT -5
www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/EJMontini/164851E.J. MONTINI'S COLUMNS & BLOG E.J. Montini is a columnist for The Arizona Republic. Will Glendale residents seal their own doom? After years of watching politicians, businessmen and sports moguls transform the dream of a thriving sports arena with a professional hockey team into a financial disaster, Glendale residents like Gary Livingston may finally get their chance to seal their own doom. And they probably will. This week Judge Dean Fink ruled that the arrangement approved between Glendale city council and potential Coyotes owner Greg Jamison didn’t have the votes to be considered an “emergency” ordinance, meaning that residents can collect signatures and put the agreement to a citywide vote. That would please folks like Livingston, who was one of those who volunteered to serve as a plaintiff in any legal actions brought against the city by The Goldwater Institute. “There is no trust in this city anymore,” Livingston told me. “The politicians used to say to me, ‘Hey, we had to think outside of the box.’ I have no problem with that. But there is such a thing as due diligence. Nobody did any due diligence as far as I’m concerned with this thing.” Judge Fink had been asked by lawyers from Goldwater to invalidate the entire deal that was worked out between the council and Jamison’s group. He hasn’t ruled on that yet, but seemed reluctant to squash the arrangement. If the judge lets the ordinance stand residents of the city will have to collect 1,862 valid signatures in order to take the Coyotes deal out of the hands of politicians, business executives and think tank lawyers and put it into the hands of voters. Guys like Gary Livingston have been hoping for just such an opportunity. “I’ve had a running battle with Glendale for years,” he said. “I’ve lived here since 1980. Been in Arizona since 71. I was trying to get some information out of the city and I couldn’t. I sent an e-mail to Goldwater and said, ‘Hey, you can use my name if you want to sue them.’ The frustration with everybody here is that we don’t feel like we have any recourse. This used to be a great bedroom community. My kids grew up here. They went to Greenway High School. My wife was born and raised in Glendale. The right way to do things with venues like the Coyotes facility is to put it to a citizen vote. They just refuse to do that.” The deal worked out between the city and Jamison calls for a 20-year lease agreement in which Glendale agreed to pay Jamison $10 million to $20 million annually to operate the arena. The hockey people say that such an arrangement is necessary in order to keep the Coyotes in the Valley. The Goldwater Institute has challenged this particular arrangement as potentially violating the “gift clause” of the Arizona constitution. For folks who don’t have a philosophical or political dog in the fight, Glendale officials were stuck with two bad choices: Pay an excessive amount to Jamison and put local taxpayers in a financial bind in order to keep the Coyotes here, or make things even worse by having the team leave, creating a economic domino effect that could ruin a number of local businesses and put hundreds of people out of work. “I personally believe that they are stuck between two bad choices,” Livingston said. “But what do we do? I’d like to see everybody put their cards on the table in front of an independent moderator who could evaluate things.” Citizens might get their chance. If enough signatures are collect the city will have some time to look them over. Then the county will do the same. If enough signatures are valid an election will be held. That’s not good news for the National Hockey League or potential owners of the Coyotes. There are a lot of angry, frustrated Glendale residents. Resentment alone might be enough for them to vote in a way that makes the situation even worse. Then again, if someone is going to cut off your nose to spite your face it might as well be you. (Column for June 21, 2012, Arizona Republic)
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 21, 2012 12:21:30 GMT -5
www.nhl.com/ice/schedulebyseason.htm?team=queSomeone on the Zone Nordiques board somehow found this page on NHL.com! For the 2012-13, for June 21, 2012, for "all teams", it says: "No Nordiques games scheduled". !!!!!!!!!!! Not sure how to navigate to it, but the page seems to exist. [Update - Actually, all you have to do to navigate to it is (1) go to the schedule "by day" display (2) have the filter set to "all teams". Of course, there are no NHL games schedule today, but the display says "No Nordiques games scheduled!!!!] Update - probably a false alarm. Apparently you can produce the same result for the Oakland Seals (long gone since the early 70's)
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 22, 2012 2:25:03 GMT -5
Some tweets are quoting rumours that 1/2 of the required signatures have already been obtained for the petition!
Lisa H. has been asked if she can confirm this.
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 23, 2012 10:26:48 GMT -5
Lots of optimism on the Zone Nordiques this morning. people everywere (ZN, JHF and twitter) all see Bettman's 10 minute coffee with Patrick Roy as being very significant, and not accidental at all. Roy is widely reported as being part of the new ownership and management group.
The Zone Nordiques people follow Jetsfan88 on JHF, and hang on every word he has to say. With his recent pronouncements that the NHL will not wait more than 10 days to make the announcement, they are very excited.
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Post by NHLJets2point0 on Jun 23, 2012 11:18:23 GMT -5
I'm secretly wishing for a lame duck season in Glendale. We all agree Phoenix don't deserve a team and that they will never "turn things around" A lame duck season would: 1. Show how little they would care if the team left. No rallies or public outcry, just neglect. 2. Prove that the NHL did everything it could. I doubt Glendale will be able to sue if they get 2,000 or less (much less?) attendance for some games in the fall 3. Give Quebec a chance to set things up and do it right once the team moves. They are NOT ready and certainly not on short notice. 4. (I know this is bitter but I don't care) Teach those people a lesson. You lost your team and here's 41 home games as reminders why. We had to endure it, I would like to see them have to go through it too.
PS For anyone who says we jets fans let our team die in 1996 you know zippo. Our team had to pay a 40% surcharge on salaries and the owner was being raped by the arena owners. Jets fans went through hell and paid our dues and learned a painful lesson. That means I have absolutely ZERO empathy for Phoenix.
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 24, 2012 23:33:02 GMT -5
On Zone Nordiques tonight, they are saying to not necessarily put to much faith in the Chicago radio station rumour.
BUT, they are very optimistic about an announcement, which they believe will be next week.
People in Montreal on Zone Nordiques are talking about organizing a celebration in Montreal as well, on the day that it is announced!
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 24, 2012 23:55:31 GMT -5
QcFan @zonenordiques @freddyplante @mxdan316 @luckycharmjcw Oublie ça fred! Les Nordiques s'en viennent! Cette semaine!
QcFan @ ZoneNordiques @ @ freddyplante mxdan316 @ fred luckycharmjcw Forget it! The Nordics are coming! This week!
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 25, 2012 0:00:04 GMT -5
I'm secretly wishing for a lame duck season in Glendale. We all agree Phoenix don't deserve a team and that they will never "turn things around" A lame duck season would: 1. Show how little they would care if the team left. No rallies or public outcry, just neglect. 2. Prove that the NHL did everything it could. I doubt Glendale will be able to sue if they get 2,000 or less (much less?) attendance for some games in the fall 3. Give Quebec a chance to set things up and do it right once the team moves. They are NOT ready and certainly not on short notice. 4. (I know this is bitter but I don't care) Teach those people a lesson. You lost your team and here's 41 home games as reminders why. We had to endure it, I would like to see them have to go through it too. PS For anyone who says we jets fans let our team die in 1996 you know zippo. Our team had to pay a 40% surcharge on salaries and the owner was being raped by the arena owners. Jets fans went through hell and paid our dues and learned a painful lesson. That means I have absolutely ZERO empathy for Phoenix. I have zero empathy for Phoenix as well. But I am hoping for the Nordiques to make THEIR triumphant return this year. We would have a game against them (if all goes well), which would be really, really awesome and fun, all these years later!!!!!! And, like you, I can't wait for Phoenix/Glendale to get shut down. This travesty is like a ghost of the Jets past, that is a reminder of what happened to the Jets 1.0. The sooner they are transformed into the Nordiques, the better! And like you've said, maybe someday soon they'll fix the histories too!!!! I'm sure they won't mind it if Dale 'Owerchuck is in our official record books!!!!!
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 25, 2012 7:15:16 GMT -5
On Zone Nordiques this morning they are praising the mayor of Quebec City, Regis Lebeaume, for his vision and perseverance in pursuing the new arena for Quebec, despite some vocal opposition and even a lawsuit from a former mayor of the city. Because of his vision, they say, the construction will begin in September this year!
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 25, 2012 8:44:41 GMT -5
ZN - there are some sharp exchanges. Sad, but it sounds a lot like Jetsowner.com as the tension built before May 31. There is conflict between people with differing perspectives on what might happen.
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 25, 2012 9:07:39 GMT -5
The ones to watch Overshadowed by draft, release of new NHL schedule makes for good viewing BY IAN MENDES, THE OTTAWA CITIZEN JUNE 24, 2012 STORYPHOTOS ( 1 ) New Jersey's Bryan Carter. Photograph by: LUCY NICHOLSON , REUTERS "Family connections were the dominating storyline at this past weekend’s NHL draft in Pittsburgh. The Staal and Schenn brothers were reunited through trades, and we also saw some draft selections with intriguing family dynamics. The Bruins drafted P.K. Subban’s younger brother, Malcolm — a goalie, adding more fuel to their rivalry with the Canadiens. The Devils certainly feel like the ghosts from 1994 have been exorcised, which is why they felt comfortable taking Stephane Matteau’s son with their first-round pick. The Senators even got into the mix, drafting Brian Boyle’s younger brother Tim because, presumably, Gary Roberts’ son isn’t draft-eligible just yet. But lost in the shuffle of draft weekend and these family storylines, was the fact that the league released its schedule for the upcoming 2012-13 season. There was less hype about the schedule announcement this year because most hockey insiders feel labour issues will disrupt the start of the campaign in October. If the season does start on time, however, there are plenty of games to be excited about this fall. This week, we’re going to look at some of the most compelling games on the regular-season schedule for the Ottawa Senators and the rest of the league. Five Sens games to watch for this season Nov. 2, Phoenix atOttawa: Senators fans who bought tickets for this game in the summer are confused as to why the Coyotes are wearing blue jerseys that say “Quebec” on them.Nov. 14, Boston at Ottawa: The Bruins have been dominant at Scotiabank Place over the past few years, with Tim Thomas winning nine consecutive starts in Ottawa. The Sens will have to figure out a way to beat the Bruins netminder — or hope that he really is watching this game from an underground bunker in rural Colorado. ....." Read more: www.ottawacitizen.com/sports/ones+watch/6833692/story.html#ixzz1yoWNrguq
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 25, 2012 9:09:38 GMT -5
^^^ When a prominent newspaper in Canada's capital goes to print with speculation (if not the actual assertion) that the Yotes will be Nordiques by November 2, ....well................ I hear an overweight woman of the stage exercising her vocal cords in the distance.....
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 27, 2012 1:34:20 GMT -5
This is my post on the Jet's hockey forum, on the Coyotes thread (under the heading the Business of Hockey). There are probably 100 pages on this Coyotes thread which are simply a debate between a knowledgeable and argumentative supporter of the Coyotes named "Todd", or "thedoh", and the members of the forum. Even Tim on that forum is observing that there are pages and pages with no real new information - just more of the same back-and-forth between Todd and the other forum members.
Anyway, I felt like I had to finally put in my two cents on this, so I did (pseudonym HaileyRocks):
"^^^^ [Todd's post]
It's hard [impossible ?] to win these types of arguments. They can go on forever and ever.
Oh, unless a multi-billion dollar business decides that it would prefer not to absorb more cash losses (plus revenue sharing payments to mitigate those losses), but instead decides to recover its investment (perhaps with an upcharge or inflationary increase), keep revenue sharing payments for other troubled franchises in the league, and get a nice bump (again) in its merchandise sales from a popular brand and a hockey-hungry market.
I don't even want to ask a question. I suspect this will get a response anyway. I'm just saying that my mind will suffer some form of psychological obsession with the logical analysis of this situation....if this ends with the "strange dream" ending where the Coyotes continue to play in Phoenix, while a hockey-crazy market claws at the door, and the league pours out another $100 million to rescue at least one other franchise.
The "strange dream" ending sounds too much like a story about a person with a gambling addiction, to be believable for a multi-billion dollar sports league/organization. Especially an organization where several of its teams - including some of its best franchises - are owned by significant, profitable media corporations, who know the difference between a sinkhole and a surfer's wave.
I have a recommendation for a good psychologist, but I just don't think I'm going to need it."
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 27, 2012 8:32:09 GMT -5
www.journaldequebec.com/2012/06/26/delai-repousse-de-30-joursTranslated by google translate PHOENIX COYOTES Extended deadline of 30 days The agreement which grants 25 million to the NHL ended Wednesday KEVIN DUBÉ ISSUED: TUESDAY 26 JUIN 2012, 11:49 p.m. | UPDATE: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 11:53 p.m. AFP PHOTO The NHL has no intention of abandoning the Phoenix Coyotes, at least not for now. The deputy NHL commissioner Bill Daly confirmed to the TVA Sports Tuesday night that the NHL had agreed to extend his 30-day agreement with the City of Glendale to manage the Jobing.com Arena . The second time This is the second time the NHL extends the contract one month. The first extension was to expire Wednesday. Details of the second extension are not yet finalized, but it is a matter of time, according to Daly. Recall that Glendale grants since 2009, when the team was bought out of bankruptcy by the NHL, an estimated $ 25 million per season in the League for the management of the amphitheater. The agreement was to end a month ago, but the NHL had agreed to extend by one month, since the talks with a potential buyer, namely Greg Jamison, were rife. However, things did not go as planned. Even if the NHL commissioner Gary Bettman announced at a press conference in early May in coming to an agreement in principle with Mr. Jamison, things have not changed in the file. Always in search of funds On June 8, the Glendale City Council voted overwhelmingly in favor of granting a $ 325 million over 20 years to Greg Jamison. The Goldwater Institute, a watchdog of public finances, however, managed to derail a part of the agreement. The judge hearing the case, Dean Fink, is still studying the agreement between Mr. Jamison and the City of Glendale. Probably dictate its decision once and for all the fate of the Coyotes. If it finds the valid agreement, the NHL will continue the process of purchase if Greg Jamison, of course, it manages to raise the necessary funds. In this regard, the deputy NHL commissioner Bill Daly confirmed that Mr. Jamison was always looking for investors to help him and that he "continues to work there." Otherwise, if the court declares the agreement invalid, Plan B, which is not an option for the NHL in the words of Gary Bettman, would become the most plausible option. For now, since no other investor seems to be in the portrait, the option of moving is the only alternative on the table. No date However, there is no known date or the day the judge will make a decision Fink. Just yesterday, several journalists registrants to file cover Coyotes in Arizona were on the alert on social networks, saying a trial could occur from one minute to the next. At the time of this writing, nothing had been decided on that side. - In collaboration with QMI Agency and VAT Sports
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 27, 2012 8:35:21 GMT -5
^^^ One possible interpretation of this development is that the NHL wants to wait until the petition for the referendum is filed, and checked, and confirmed, before they announce the relocation - so that they can clearly blame GWI for the team moving. July 8 is the deadline for the petition to be submitted, but I think it could be another 10 days or so before the petition is checked and confirmed. This is putting the timelines for the renovations of the colisee right to the edge of PKP's timelines, according to posts on Zone Nordiques.
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Post by jamiequirk17 on Jun 27, 2012 10:53:34 GMT -5
...and on and on and on and on....
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 27, 2012 18:27:37 GMT -5
A lot of pessimism on the Zone Nordiques board this afternoon. People in Quebec are starting to wilt under the weight of the delays and extensions being granted in Glendale.
I still firmly believe that the team will be in Quebec for the 2012-13 season, for all of the same reasons as before. The timing is not an issue from my perspective. Bettman knows darn well that the season won't start on time anyway. He has a script. Just because it's different from prior years doesn't mean he won't do something. Glendale is toast. It's 5 years from being the sports equivalent of a bombed out war zone. Bettman is too smart to stay there too long - especially when the money is rapidly running out.
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 28, 2012 0:11:53 GMT -5
There are conflicting reports from very very highly placed insiders. One says that the time frame/deadline for a move for this year is already passed. However, the other very highly placed source says that there is a July 15 deadline.
Will be very, very interesting to see how this plays out!!!!
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Post by NHLJets2point0 on Jun 28, 2012 10:31:21 GMT -5
“@clarkjv: I have blocked all Canadians. No one should have to take their abuse. Block...Block...Block†Attachments:
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 28, 2012 12:56:06 GMT -5
^^^^LOL!!!!!!!!!
Saw that on twitter - nice to have it here as well to look at and laugh, when I need a laugh!
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 28, 2012 13:06:30 GMT -5
Status as of June 28 re Coyotes:
-Judge ruled that lease and management fee agreement was valid. The judge did not agree with GWI's arguments.
-The deadline for the petition is July 9 (since July 8 is a Sunday). However, by the time that the petition is checked out for validity, it will likely be after July 15, which is apparently the deadline for a purchase by the Quebec folks for 2012.
-One report on ZN suggests that the NHL Board has already said that it is too late for 2012. However, the other insider report said that there is a July 15, 2012 deadline for a 2012 move. The "July 15" group is still optimistic for 2012.
-By all accounts, Jamison does not have anywhere near the amount of money he needs to complete the purchase. It seems inconceivable that he will be able to close the deal at all, extension or no extension. He apparently has an an extension to late July to close his deal - unlikely or not. That is also well past the apparent July 15 deadline for the Quebec group.
-Based on the above, the NHL is skating dangerously close to the thin ice, where they would have to operate the team in Glendale for one more year, which would surely be regarded as a lame duck season. If the petition goes forward, and if the referendum kills the deal - apparently in November coinciding with the US presidential election - then the Coyotes would be lame duck for almost all of their 2012-13 season in Glendale. One can only imagine the emptiness of Jobbing.com arena. One cannot possibly imagine the magnitude of the financial losses to the NHL. Expenses minus revenue sharing payment minus Glendale fees - wait no, not minus Glendale fees - equals one big loss.
-GB will wake up from this nightmare on the morning of July 13 (Friday the 13th) and sign the deal with Peladeau. He will say that it has become apparent that, despite the best efforts of good people at the city hall, and Gary Jamison, the investors could not tolerate the uncertainty created by GWI. As such, the NHL has been forced to examine alternatives, and has concluded a deal with PKP to purchase the team and move it to Quebec.
And as Forest Gump said, "And that's all I've got to say about that!"
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Post by NHLJets2point0 on Jun 28, 2012 22:43:15 GMT -5
Actually the deadline for the petition is July 16 (since July 15 is a Sunday). This is due to delays from the Glendale Clerks office not having the paperwork ready for the public until June 15 and they are promised 30 days to collect the signatures.
This is a bonus for referendum supporters as this adds to the delays in committing to the vote. GWI (or the public lobby group) can sit on the petition until mid0July and then reveal they have plenty of signatures and will force the vote.
This stall tactic should put a little extra pressure on the NHL assuming they are stalling and waiting to see if the deal will be "filibustered"
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Post by swervinmervin on Jun 29, 2012 11:31:43 GMT -5
Déclaration de Daly très intéressante... “I think we are past the point of having to defend or prove the league's continuing desire to keep the team in Glendale. We've owned and funded the team's operations for nearly three years now. We have been 100 percent transparent on our intentions. At the end of the day, that might not prove possible. But if we are ever forced to explore and pursue alternatives, it will no be from a lack of desire or effort to make the team work in Arizona.” - Lisa Haverstadt @lisahalverstadt www.facebook.com/LisaHalverstadt
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